Please post a reading response to any of the Antigone material--the Sophocles text itself, the material on the blog links, and the variations excerpted in class. The response should be 200-250 words long.
there were some things (and more than here) that i wanted to keep thinking about from our discussion today: 1) play as the play (the tragedy); 2) the laws as internal v. external; 3) death in Antigone--the phrases at the end of the chorus passage that we looked at were interesting: "by gods of death, by a senseless word, by fury at the heart"; 4) who are the confusers (attributes?); 5) silence and the crime of talking about trees; 6) slavery in underworld v. slavery in earthly world; 7) what is the underground (i.e. what kind of hell is Hades)?; 8) what does the "dark" mean for Antigone--dark as bad (a curse?) v. dark as revolutionary (underground)
My response pertains to the poem “Antigone,” by Bertolt Brecht, who was a German film director during the Weimar period. He was someone who knew something about the rebellion and unwillingness to compromise that Sophocles’ Antigone is well-known for. For example, his film Kuhle Wampe was an unconventional response to the hardship Germany faced after the First World War, bluntly critical of the current right-wing government. The following lines fascinate me: “…I know / How much you dreaded death, and yet / Even more you dreaded / Life without dignity.” One thing that motivated Antigone’s seemingly fearless actions was fear itself. A fear of “life without dignity.” Dignity, according to the OED, is “the quality of being worthy or honourable…” (http://dictionary.oed.com/). Antigone believed she was doing something worthy, something that would please the gods, whom she was convinced were worthier of being pleased than the king of her city. Though Ismene is often seen the cowardly sister, Brecht portrays Antigone as also being plagued by two fears, the fear of death and the fear of living without honor. Yet one fear is stronger than the other, and this, along with her tenacity and love, is what makes Antigone a heroine in my eyes, and apparently in Brecht’s.
In class on Tuesday, we were talking about different themes in Antigone, one of them being Creon and his dislike for those who desired money (another form of power). And as I was reading the play, I came across the part where he was uspet with the seer, Tiresias, and believed that he was prophesizing only for profit. Creon states, “You and the whole breed of seers are mad for money!” (Pg. 113, Line 1171) and Tiresias is baffled that Creon believes his prophesies to be lies, when Creon always heeded his advice up until now. As I read this part, I thought it was rather odd for Creon to touch on the subject of money. To me, it seemed all that he was doing was looking for an excuse for Tiresias’ prophecy to be incorrect. Creon was stubborn until the very end, and did not decide to waver until it was too late and everyone around hi was dead. Reading the play, I pictured him in his encounter with Tiresias to be trying to hold on to his edict, but all the more in the back of his mind, he was beginning to even doubt himself. When Creon says to Tiresias, “Know full well, you’ll never buy off my resolve” he seems to be trying to justify the fact for his stubbornness, but in reality, the only person Creon was fooling, was himself. This overly dominating way of rule he took on, Creon was not ruling the “land for others” but for himself.
In this passage, Creon has just found out from the Sentry that someone has buried Polynices by covering him with a thin layer of dust from the earth. Angered, he assumes that the soldiers guarding the corpse were bribed to bury it. He rants about the dangers of money saying, “Money! Nothing worse/ in our lives, so current, rampant, so corrupting.” However, I am forced to question whether Creon ever related money to power. Throughout Antigone, he has been trying to assert his power and law over the citizens of Thebes. He is blind to the dangers of his thirst for power. Creon is blind to his own human faults and constantly tries to declare that his edict is from Zeus, making his word divine. When he states, “they’ve made one thing sure at least:/ sooner or later they will pay the price.” These words foreshadow Creon’s fate. By defying the divine family laws of burying the dead, this exemplifies that he is more powerful than the gods. Thus, Creon is portrayed as a hypocrite. He blames others for giving into the vices of money when he himself has succumbed to the corruption of power. Unfortunately, it takes Creon too long to realize his errors in judgment, and he too “pay[s] the price” for his unjust law with the lives of his wife and son.
Antigone places the unwritten law above the edict pronounced by Creon. By planning on burying her brother, Polynices, Antigone is making a large political statement. In the beginning of the play, Antigone is talking to Ismene and she says “My one flesh and blood.” From this point, it is evident that Antigone holds on strongly to her blood relationships and for her, these relationships are above all other factors. As mentioned in the text, the political message really comes into play when Creon gives his speech to the people. He mentions: “And whoever places a friend / above the good of his own country, he is nothing.” Although Creon is not aware of this at the time, Antigone is such a person. She puts the blood relationship of her and Polynices before the rule of the state. Another evident difference between Creon and Antigone is there take on religious factors. Antigone’s response is a religious one. She believes that the laws of the Gods take a larger precedent over the laws of the state. On the other hand, Creon believes that the laws of the state take a larger precedent over the laws of the Gods. According to Creon, a state would never support the proper burial of a traitor to the state and this is why Creon gives his decree.
My response concerns the young and the old and the differences in how each is guided in life. In Antigone, the youth are passionate, rebellious, and often seen as irrational as they are guided by their emotions, while the old are portrayed as more rational for obeying laws and being governed by practicalities. While both parties illustrate pros and cons for each way of living, for me it raised the question as to which way is, not necessarily the right way, but the way in which we should aim to live? For example, Antigone is distraught because her brother Polynices has not had a proper burial and so she risks death in order to do what she feels is for a just cause. I most certainly find her courage and passion admirable characteristics, however in a sense her unyielding demeanor could also be deemed as foolish. While Creon on the other hand is all about sticking to the rules of the state, his unyielding demeanor can be seen as cruel, immoral, and inhumane. After reading Antigone, I feel that we as the reader are to side with the youth because we are encompassed with the drama and tragedy allowing us to more easily relate to Antigone as it is harder to do so with the barbaric actions of Creon. However, if in a more modern setting, or rather if this idea of living based on passion or rules were applied to our world, I begin to question where the balance between the two is and which we are to aim for?
My comment is a response to two of the study questions regarding the importance of traditions and burial. Although Antigone feels obligated to uphold the ties of family, her actions are also in part a result of piety and religious devotion. Her loyalty to the gods is evident in the following passage, when she declares that leaving Polynices unburied is “an outrage sacred to the gods! / [she has] longer to please the dead than please the living here” (88-89). Antigone places more importance and more trust in the rulers of the kingdom of the underworld than she does in the ruler of the state. The importance of supreme deities is also expressed in the speech given by the blind prophet, Tiresias. He places blame entirely on Creon, stating that his prevention of Polynices’ burial is “robb[ing] the gods below the earth” and “set[ting] the plague on Thebes.” The use of the word “plague” emphasizes the high degree to which the Theban citizens believe that their actions directly anger the gods. The motif of religious importance is thus evident throughout the play from different characters that all have varying amounts of piety. In regards to burial of the dead, it is necessary in this play because it pleases the gods when dead bodies are interred, allowing them to be incorporated into the earth and kingdom below.
Antigone is a good comparison of the theme "doing" of this quarter, in that, many of her actions are a representation of what is right according to her own morals (law of the gods) rather than the norm laws of the earth (laws of the land). This is seen in the entirety of the plot when Antigone decides to bury her brother, because she morally felt obligated to do so. It takes the strength of one character to keep their morals and go against those who are thought to be "confusers". In this case, it could be Ismene who attempts to persuade her sister to obey the law of the land, however Antigone does not. Other persuaders could include Creon who tries to scare Antigone with his power. In relation, Death can be thought of on a variety of levels. Some may think that Death could resemble the literal death of the family line, however Death can be thought of in another sense. Death could mean the death of the obedience of political laws and new life could be thought of as a person thinking for themselves, or a person's own moral laws. Even in a more modern time these ideas are brought forth, such as the civil rights movement.
For my response, I chose to respond to Bertolt Brecht's "To Prosperity". In class on Tuesday, my group and I discussed this part of Brecht's poem specifically the first half of what we have on our papers. The first half seems to relate directly to Creon's character. The "smooth forehead" signifies Creon and his inexperience with any worries, as opposed to Antigone who has gone through so much misfortune. Brecht also writes that the one "who laughs has not yet heard the terrible tidings", I understand this as Creon being inconsiderate towards Antigone's situation and it also foreshadows that something tragic could happen to Creon because he does not yet understand what kind of misery can be brought upon to an individual. The second part of Brecht's poem is directed more towards Antigone's position on things. In the poem we see how the writer thinks it's ridiculous that there are some laws that just cannot be followed.
My response is concerning the topic of having darkness as a reoccurring theme. It intrigues me that people consider Antigone to be “honorable” and even “martyr” worthy, yet the novel and other poems parallel her to darkness. Usually when one refers to something dark, they make it mean something along the lines of “evil” or “immoral”. One may also argue that darkness does not have to hold a negative connotation. It may mean the Antigone is “mysterious”, producing an urge for the reader to get to know her. I believe that Antigone tries to do her own thing, kind of like those independent people in today’s society. In the poem Antigone (1948) by Bertolt Brecht, he mentions darkness in the first line. We talked about this in class that Antigone emerges from a “darkness”. I believe that the darkness could perhaps be society and their way of thinking. She goes from this conventional thinking to go and set forth on her own path. The last line reads, “And over their atrocities there grew no grass.” I personally think this is an open ending, which can be paralleled to Antigone and the future of her endeavors. Going back to the theme of darkness, the class spoke about how “dark” meant “death”, which then led to the question of what death was to Antigone. I believe death to Antigone is something to be worshipped and revered. I believe that Antigone wants someone’s death to be an honor, in order to reflect the life of the man. After finishing the plan, Antigone by Brecht, seems like a pefect example of Antigone. However, I am excited to read more poems and passages that describe Antigone in a different manner.
In lecture and in discussion section, we talked about the family laws and the state laws. Antigone obviously disobeyed the state laws by burying her brother, Polynices, after Creon clearly stated that no one was allowed to mourn him or perform any proper burial rituals. I think that Antigone's defiance of the state laws goes deeper than wanting to obey the family laws. Her loyalty is what drives her to disobey the external laws of the state. Her father, Oedipus, has brought grief to their family and their name has been tainted by all the misfortune. Although her father has brought them misfortune and her brothers were murdered, she remains loyal to them by still respecting their bodies and their name. She recognizes the fact that Oedipus "handed down" grief, but she does not curse him. I think that by staying loyal to her family and burying her brother, while disobeying the state law, she hopes to save her family from their bad reputation. She does not care that she is breaking the law. She cares more about respecting her family and staying loyal to them even if it causes her trouble. Loyalty to her family is more important that loyalty to her state.
I actually chose to analyze Zach Enders animation of Antigone from the link of the youtube video on the side. I actually found it quite amusing and strange at the same time. He used images of Drew Barrymore, Jack Black, Johnny Depp, Pat Morita, Alan Rickman, and Uma Thurman to portray his story, with Uma Thurman as Antigone and Alan Rickman as Creon. Although cheesy and poorly animated, it did reveal similar themes as we discussed in our first discussion section. One major theme I noticed was that of darkness or blackness. Almost all the scenes consisted of a dark setting, either black or dark night blue, along with grays and reds. This relates to our feelings of dark referring to bad. All while these dark scenes took place, evil and scary sounding music accompanied the scene. At the end, only when the scene had yellow and its first appearance of pink did lighter sounding music appear. So regardless of the quality of the animation, or the silly dialogue that obviously does not reflect that of Sophocles, or even the inclusion of a variety of actors as the characters, the interpretation of darkness and darkness as being evil also found its way into Zach Enders interpretation of Antigone.
Previewing Thursday’s lecture notes, I found that Professor Hart’s point that “Antigone’s coldness toward Ismene” can factor against the point that Antigone fully represents the familial side of Greek society. In fact, she accuses Ismene of trying to steal the glory: “Never share my dying, / don’t lay claim to what you never touched. / My death will be enough (615-617). If she can be loyal to her brother, then her reasons for being disloyal to her sister are questionable. Although Ismene initially didn’t agree with Antigone’s act against Creon’s decree, she did remain loyal to Antigone as she was willing to face death; so it would only be fair if Antigone would respond with reciprocity. I found Professor’s Hart’s point to be interesting as it allows the reader to delve into Antigone’s motives for being disloyal to her sister. I think the main reason behind her decision to, in a sense, break the ties of sisterhood, is simple pride. Thus, Antigone’s character embodies the ultimate flaw of Greek heroes: hubris. Rendering herself as a hypocrite, Antigone’s real reasons for staying loyal to her brother are contradicted and brought under scrutiny with her relationship with her sister. The validity of her claim of family importance as being more significant than state law is shaken.
In lecture on Tuesday, an interesting topic I found that was being discussed was Antigone’s family versus state ordeal. As I understood from lecture, it appeared that Antigone was caught in a dilemma of some sort. Specifically she had to choice of whether to give her brother the proper burial. At this period in time, the importance of a burial, from what I learned in lecture was very great. A burial ensured that the deceased person would be transported or sent to the "underworld" of some sort in a proper manner. As we talked about in discussion, the underworld was also a place similar to the Christian "hell." However, from what I’ve learned about Greek mythology, Hades was a place that was not only where the bad went, but the good went as well. It was a place for mortals after their death. This is of great contrast to the Christian’s belief in heaven and a hell. The two places differed because the good souls would go to heaven and the immoral souls would go to hell. The fact that Antigone chooses to send her brother to the next life shows her strong belief in the religion at the time as well. The belief of many gods or polytheism is most common in Greek mythology but is also related to roman mythology which is very similar. It is much different from the monotheism of the Christians. I would like to continue exploring the importance of religion in the text and discover its juxtaposition with other religions.
My Response is the analysis of the Chorus. The chorus begins by talking about the ones that are 'truly blest all their lives' and 'never tasted devastation.' Here it is talking about the ones who are of higher social class and have a more comfortable life like Antigone and her family. It then talks about the 'ruins [that] will never cease, cresting on and on from one generation on through the race,' which is saying that the 'ruin,' which is something bad that brings diaster, will keep going on and on. This is a foreshadow of diasters that's going to happen. The Chorus then talks about the 'great mounting tide' that's 'driven on by savage northern gales,' which is like a 'storm's onslaught [at] full-force' that 'echoes on and on.' Here it compares the tragedy that is going to happen to the force of nature that makes waves and storms. The 'sorrow of the hosue' of the 'living heirs of all the old ancentral kings' is talking about the family of Opedius, which has experience many sorrows with the death of most of its family members. And the sorrows will not stop; it will continue 'piling on the sorrows of the dead' which foreshadows more deaths upon the dead. It goes on to say that 'one generation cannot free the next,' which talks about how Antigone and how she cannot free her brother, and how 'the race finds no release' because death keeps happening. And, 'springing up from the late last root in the house of Oedipus,' which is Antigone, because she is the 'last root' in the Oedipus family, will be 'cut down in turn by the long, bloody knife swung by the gods of death.' Through reading the Chorus, we realize that it is a foreshadow of Antigone's death, her being the 'last root' of the family, being 'cut down in turn' by the 'long, bloody knife.' The Chorus tells the reader of Antigone's family and the many sorrows that occured in the 'house of Oedipus,' and how this race can 'find no release,' where sorrow keeps 'piling on the sorrows of the dead' and ultimately Antigone too will be cut down.
One of the things that stuck out most to me most from the lecture was Creon’s line where he says, “And is Thebes about to tell me how to rule? […] Am I to rule this land for others or for myself? […] The city is the king’s-that’s the law!” (Sophocles, p.97, ln.821) While at first Creon’s exclamation must seem ridiculous to a modern audience, it reflects the inherent disdain for monarchies and oligarchies an ancient Athenian audience would have had. The character model that Sophocles gives to Creon can be viewed in a historical context; where it becomes clear that it is not merely stereotyped archetype – but rather, a recurring theme among governments who rule without the consensus of the people. The first thing that came to mind after looking at Creon’s speech was the Legalist philosophy which dominated the Qin dynasty of China in the third century BC. The Legalists believed in the absolute power of the state, and that the purpose of the people was to serve the ruler. Li Si was one of the chief Legalist proponents, and in a letter to the Second Emperor, Qin Ershi, preserved in Sima Qian’s Shiji, or Records of the Grand Historian, he says, “If [the Son of Heaven] cannot [...] exploit the empire for his own gratification, but merely makes it his duty to weary his body and strain his spirit in order to serve the hundred clans, then he is a lackey of the black-headed people (commoners), not the caretaker of the empire. How could such a man be called honored?” (Shiji, Biography of Li Si) Clearly, Sophocles uses Creon as a tool to criticize the Theban Monarchy.
I am responding to 3 lines that jumped out to me in Antigone. The lines are 706-709 These lines are said when Creon is telling his son, Haemon about Antigone’s fate for her defiance against the state: “Son, you;ve heard the final verdict on your bride? Are you coming now, raving against your father? Or do you love me, no matter what I do? I thought this passage was interesting because throughout the play, Creon is explaining to everybody that everything must be done for the greatness of the state. However, he contradicts that argument in these lines. He is asking his son to put aside all of his beliefs and do something solely for the love of his father. Typically Creon’s actions and words say to put the country or state above family. This is where Antigone has defied him. However, in these lines, Creon tells his son to put family above all else. Creon could be doing this for two reasons: Either he has realized that family is more important than anything else or the more likely situation, he is manipulating his son to be on his side by appealing to his son’s love.
Savarkar, Selections from The Indian War of Independence
Gandhi, Hind Swaraj
Kleist, Michael Kohlhaas
Gernhard Joseph, "The Antigone as Cultural Touchstone..."
Fleischman, "Search for the Dead in a Now-Quiet Forest"
Brecht, The Antigone Legend
Sophocles, Antigone
Research Projects
Group Presentations of Research Techniques—please prepare the material from the HCC Writer’s Guide chapter. Your goal will be to inform the rest of the class of the important material in the chapter by associating or linking this information to your own research projects. This means that you will need to choose an object/artifact (or topic/issue/event) that you will present “on”—since you will be working in groups of 3 or 4, you might decide to do it on little parts of each, or a combination, or to use certain aspects of each to illustrate and explain different concepts in each of the chapters. You should always try to address and present to the rest of the class things that are potentially difficult or problematic about this step of the process and ways that you found of dealing with the problems or difficulties you encountered. Presentations should be 7-12 minutes, with 5-10 minutes for questions. The rest of the class should have prepared (i.e. read) the HCC Chapter before the presentation and should have the writer’s guide in class; questions are very much encouraged. Presentations will be every Thursday, and will count for part of your discussion participation grade. Grades are based on thoroughness of material presented from HCC chapter, originality and liveliness of examples from individual research projects, and willingness to discuss problems and difficulties of the research step. Handouts welcome.
Schedule of Group Presentations: Week 4: "Research Questions" (22)--Noelle, Melissa, Brenda, Stephanie Week 5: "Audience and Purpose" (23)--Cheryl, Michael, Zach, Scott Week 6: "Electronic Research Methods" (29)--David, Miriam, Rachel Week 7: "Library Research Methods" (28)--Melanie, Sharilyn, Kristine, Heather Week 8: "Counterarguments" (24)--Hannah, Gunner, Peter Week 9: "Citing Sources" (27)--Moniqa, Daniel, Akash
17 comments:
there were some things (and more than here) that i wanted to keep thinking about from our discussion today: 1) play as the play (the tragedy); 2) the laws as internal v. external; 3) death in Antigone--the phrases at the end of the chorus passage that we looked at were interesting: "by gods of death, by a senseless word, by fury at the heart"; 4) who are the confusers (attributes?); 5) silence and the crime of talking about trees; 6) slavery in underworld v. slavery in earthly world; 7) what is the underground (i.e. what kind of hell is Hades)?; 8) what does the "dark" mean for Antigone--dark as bad (a curse?) v. dark as revolutionary (underground)
My response pertains to the poem “Antigone,” by Bertolt Brecht, who was a German film director during the Weimar period. He was someone who knew something about the rebellion and unwillingness to compromise that Sophocles’ Antigone is well-known for. For example, his film Kuhle Wampe was an unconventional response to the hardship Germany faced after the First World War, bluntly critical of the current right-wing government. The following lines fascinate me: “…I know / How much you dreaded death, and yet / Even more you dreaded / Life without dignity.” One thing that motivated Antigone’s seemingly fearless actions was fear itself. A fear of “life without dignity.” Dignity, according to the OED, is “the quality of being worthy or honourable…” (http://dictionary.oed.com/). Antigone believed she was doing something worthy, something that would please the gods, whom she was convinced were worthier of being pleased than the king of her city. Though Ismene is often seen the cowardly sister, Brecht portrays Antigone as also being plagued by two fears, the fear of death and the fear of living without honor. Yet one fear is stronger than the other, and this, along with her tenacity and love, is what makes Antigone a heroine in my eyes, and apparently in Brecht’s.
In class on Tuesday, we were talking about different themes in Antigone, one of them being Creon and his dislike for those who desired money (another form of power). And as I was reading the play, I came across the part where he was uspet with the seer, Tiresias, and believed that he was prophesizing only for profit. Creon states, “You and the whole breed of seers are mad for money!” (Pg. 113, Line 1171) and Tiresias is baffled that Creon believes his prophesies to be lies, when Creon always heeded his advice up until now.
As I read this part, I thought it was rather odd for Creon to touch on the subject of money. To me, it seemed all that he was doing was looking for an excuse for Tiresias’ prophecy to be incorrect. Creon was stubborn until the very end, and did not decide to waver until it was too late and everyone around hi was dead. Reading the play, I pictured him in his encounter with Tiresias to be trying to hold on to his edict, but all the more in the back of his mind, he was beginning to even doubt himself. When Creon says to Tiresias, “Know full well, you’ll never buy off my resolve” he seems to be trying to justify the fact for his stubbornness, but in reality, the only person Creon was fooling, was himself. This overly dominating way of rule he took on, Creon was not ruling the “land for others” but for himself.
Antigone, Lines 335-343
In this passage, Creon has just found out from the Sentry that someone has buried Polynices by covering him with a thin layer of dust from the earth. Angered, he assumes that the soldiers guarding the corpse were bribed to bury it. He rants about the dangers of money saying, “Money! Nothing worse/ in our lives, so current, rampant, so corrupting.” However, I am forced to question whether Creon ever related money to power. Throughout Antigone, he has been trying to assert his power and law over the citizens of Thebes. He is blind to the dangers of his thirst for power. Creon is blind to his own human faults and constantly tries to declare that his edict is from Zeus, making his word divine. When he states, “they’ve made one thing sure at least:/ sooner or later they will pay the price.” These words foreshadow Creon’s fate. By defying the divine family laws of burying the dead, this exemplifies that he is more powerful than the gods. Thus, Creon is portrayed as a hypocrite. He blames others for giving into the vices of money when he himself has succumbed to the corruption of power. Unfortunately, it takes Creon too long to realize his errors in judgment, and he too “pay[s] the price” for his unjust law with the lives of his wife and son.
Antigone places the unwritten law above the edict pronounced by Creon. By planning on burying her brother, Polynices, Antigone is making a large political statement. In the beginning of the play, Antigone is talking to Ismene and she says “My one flesh and blood.” From this point, it is evident that Antigone holds on strongly to her blood relationships and for her, these relationships are above all other factors. As mentioned in the text, the political message really comes into play when Creon gives his speech to the people. He mentions: “And whoever places a friend / above the good of his own country, he is nothing.” Although Creon is not aware of this at the time, Antigone is such a person. She puts the blood relationship of her and Polynices before the rule of the state. Another evident difference between Creon and Antigone is there take on religious factors. Antigone’s response is a religious one. She believes that the laws of the Gods take a larger precedent over the laws of the state. On the other hand, Creon believes that the laws of the state take a larger precedent over the laws of the Gods. According to Creon, a state would never support the proper burial of a traitor to the state and this is why Creon gives his decree.
My response concerns the young and the old and the differences in how each is guided in life. In Antigone, the youth are passionate, rebellious, and often seen as irrational as they are guided by their emotions, while the old are portrayed as more rational for obeying laws and being governed by practicalities. While both parties illustrate pros and cons for each way of living, for me it raised the question as to which way is, not necessarily the right way, but the way in which we should aim to live? For example, Antigone is distraught because her brother Polynices has not had a proper burial and so she risks death in order to do what she feels is for a just cause. I most certainly find her courage and passion admirable characteristics, however in a sense her unyielding demeanor could also be deemed as foolish. While Creon on the other hand is all about sticking to the rules of the state, his unyielding demeanor can be seen as cruel, immoral, and inhumane. After reading Antigone, I feel that we as the reader are to side with the youth because we are encompassed with the drama and tragedy allowing us to more easily relate to Antigone as it is harder to do so with the barbaric actions of Creon. However, if in a more modern setting, or rather if this idea of living based on passion or rules were applied to our world, I begin to question where the balance between the two is and which we are to aim for?
My comment is a response to two of the study questions regarding the importance of traditions and burial. Although Antigone feels obligated to uphold the ties of family, her actions are also in part a result of piety and religious devotion. Her loyalty to the gods is evident in the following passage, when she declares that leaving Polynices unburied is “an outrage sacred to the gods! / [she has] longer to please the dead than please the living here” (88-89). Antigone places more importance and more trust in the rulers of the kingdom of the underworld than she does in the ruler of the state. The importance of supreme deities is also expressed in the speech given by the blind prophet, Tiresias. He places blame entirely on Creon, stating that his prevention of Polynices’ burial is “robb[ing] the gods below the earth” and “set[ting] the plague on Thebes.” The use of the word “plague” emphasizes the high degree to which the Theban citizens believe that their actions directly anger the gods. The motif of religious importance is thus evident throughout the play from different characters that all have varying amounts of piety. In regards to burial of the dead, it is necessary in this play because it pleases the gods when dead bodies are interred, allowing them to be incorporated into the earth and kingdom below.
Antigone is a good comparison of the theme "doing" of this quarter, in that, many of her actions are a representation of what is right according to her own morals (law of the gods) rather than the norm laws of the earth (laws of the land). This is seen in the entirety of the plot when Antigone decides to bury her brother, because she morally felt obligated to do so. It takes the strength of one character to keep their morals and go against those who are thought to be "confusers". In this case, it could be Ismene who attempts to persuade her sister to obey the law of the land, however Antigone does not. Other persuaders could include Creon who tries to scare Antigone with his power. In relation, Death can be thought of on a variety of levels. Some may think that Death could resemble the literal death of the family line, however Death can be thought of in another sense. Death could mean the death of the obedience of political laws and new life could be thought of as a person thinking for themselves, or a person's own moral laws. Even in a more modern time these ideas are brought forth, such as the civil rights movement.
For my response, I chose to respond to Bertolt Brecht's "To Prosperity". In class on Tuesday, my group and I discussed this part of Brecht's poem specifically the first half of what we have on our papers. The first half seems to relate directly to Creon's character. The "smooth forehead" signifies Creon and his inexperience with any worries, as opposed to Antigone who has gone through so much misfortune. Brecht also writes that the one "who laughs has not yet heard the terrible tidings", I understand this as Creon being inconsiderate towards Antigone's situation and it also foreshadows that something tragic could happen to Creon because he does not yet understand what kind of misery can be brought upon to an individual.
The second part of Brecht's poem is directed more towards Antigone's position on things. In the poem we see how the writer thinks it's ridiculous that there are some laws that just cannot be followed.
My response is concerning the topic of having darkness as a reoccurring theme. It intrigues me that people consider Antigone to be “honorable” and even “martyr” worthy, yet the novel and other poems parallel her to darkness. Usually when one refers to something dark, they make it mean something along the lines of “evil” or “immoral”. One may also argue that darkness does not have to hold a negative connotation. It may mean the Antigone is “mysterious”, producing an urge for the reader to get to know her. I believe that Antigone tries to do her own thing, kind of like those independent people in today’s society. In the poem Antigone (1948) by Bertolt Brecht, he mentions darkness in the first line. We talked about this in class that Antigone emerges from a “darkness”. I believe that the darkness could perhaps be society and their way of thinking. She goes from this conventional thinking to go and set forth on her own path. The last line reads, “And over their atrocities there grew no grass.” I personally think this is an open ending, which can be paralleled to Antigone and the future of her endeavors. Going back to the theme of darkness, the class spoke about how “dark” meant “death”, which then led to the question of what death was to Antigone. I believe death to Antigone is something to be worshipped and revered. I believe that Antigone wants someone’s death to be an honor, in order to reflect the life of the man. After finishing the plan, Antigone by Brecht, seems like a pefect example of Antigone. However, I am excited to read more poems and passages that describe Antigone in a different manner.
In lecture and in discussion section, we talked about the family laws and the state laws. Antigone obviously disobeyed the state laws by burying her brother, Polynices, after Creon clearly stated that no one was allowed to mourn him or perform any proper burial rituals. I think that Antigone's defiance of the state laws goes deeper than wanting to obey the family laws. Her loyalty is what drives her to disobey the external laws of the state. Her father, Oedipus, has brought grief to their family and their name has been tainted by all the misfortune. Although her father has brought them misfortune and her brothers were murdered, she remains loyal to them by still respecting their bodies and their name. She recognizes the fact that Oedipus "handed down" grief, but she does not curse him. I think that by staying loyal to her family and burying her brother, while disobeying the state law, she hopes to save her family from their bad reputation. She does not care that she is breaking the law. She cares more about respecting her family and staying loyal to them even if it causes her trouble. Loyalty to her family is more important that loyalty to her state.
I actually chose to analyze Zach Enders animation of Antigone from the link of the youtube video on the side. I actually found it quite amusing and strange at the same time. He used images of Drew Barrymore, Jack Black, Johnny Depp, Pat Morita, Alan Rickman, and Uma Thurman to portray his story, with Uma Thurman as Antigone and Alan Rickman as Creon. Although cheesy and poorly animated, it did reveal similar themes as we discussed in our first discussion section. One major theme I noticed was that of darkness or blackness. Almost all the scenes consisted of a dark setting, either black or dark night blue, along with grays and reds. This relates to our feelings of dark referring to bad. All while these dark scenes took place, evil and scary sounding music accompanied the scene. At the end, only when the scene had yellow and its first appearance of pink did lighter sounding music appear. So regardless of the quality of the animation, or the silly dialogue that obviously does not reflect that of Sophocles, or even the inclusion of a variety of actors as the characters, the interpretation of darkness and darkness as being evil also found its way into Zach Enders interpretation of Antigone.
Previewing Thursday’s lecture notes, I found that Professor Hart’s point that “Antigone’s coldness toward Ismene” can factor against the point that Antigone fully represents the familial side of Greek society. In fact, she accuses Ismene of trying to steal the glory: “Never share my dying, / don’t lay claim to what you never touched. / My death will be enough (615-617). If she can be loyal to her brother, then her reasons for being disloyal to her sister are questionable. Although Ismene initially didn’t agree with Antigone’s act against Creon’s decree, she did remain loyal to Antigone as she was willing to face death; so it would only be fair if Antigone would respond with reciprocity. I found Professor’s Hart’s point to be interesting as it allows the reader to delve into Antigone’s motives for being disloyal to her sister. I think the main reason behind her decision to, in a sense, break the ties of sisterhood, is simple pride. Thus, Antigone’s character embodies the ultimate flaw of Greek heroes: hubris. Rendering herself as a hypocrite, Antigone’s real reasons for staying loyal to her brother are contradicted and brought under scrutiny with her relationship with her sister. The validity of her claim of family importance as being more significant than state law is shaken.
In lecture on Tuesday, an interesting topic I found that was being discussed was Antigone’s family versus state ordeal. As I understood from lecture, it appeared that Antigone was caught in a dilemma of some sort. Specifically she had to choice of whether to give her brother the proper burial. At this period in time, the importance of a burial, from what I learned in lecture was very great. A burial ensured that the deceased person would be transported or sent to the "underworld" of some sort in a proper manner. As we talked about in discussion, the underworld was also a place similar to the Christian "hell." However, from what I’ve learned about Greek mythology, Hades was a place that was not only where the bad went, but the good went as well. It was a place for mortals after their death. This is of great contrast to the Christian’s belief in heaven and a hell. The two places differed because the good souls would go to heaven and the immoral souls would go to hell. The fact that Antigone chooses to send her brother to the next life shows her strong belief in the religion at the time as well. The belief of many gods or polytheism is most common in Greek mythology but is also related to roman mythology which is very similar. It is much different from the monotheism of the Christians. I would like to continue exploring the importance of religion in the text and discover its juxtaposition with other religions.
My Response is the analysis of the Chorus. The chorus begins by talking about the ones that are 'truly blest all their lives' and 'never tasted devastation.' Here it is talking about the ones who are of higher social class and have a more comfortable life like Antigone and her family. It then talks about the 'ruins [that] will never cease, cresting on and on from one generation on through the race,' which is saying that the 'ruin,' which is something bad that brings diaster, will keep going on and on. This is a foreshadow of diasters that's going to happen. The Chorus then talks about the 'great mounting tide' that's 'driven on by savage northern gales,' which is like a 'storm's onslaught [at] full-force' that 'echoes on and on.' Here it compares the tragedy that is going to happen to the force of nature that makes waves and storms. The 'sorrow of the hosue' of the 'living heirs of all the old ancentral kings' is talking about the family of Opedius, which has experience many sorrows with the death of most of its family members. And the sorrows will not stop; it will continue 'piling on the sorrows of the dead' which foreshadows more deaths upon the dead. It goes on to say that 'one generation cannot free the next,' which talks about how Antigone and how she cannot free her brother, and how 'the race finds no release' because death keeps happening. And, 'springing up from the late last root in the house of Oedipus,' which is Antigone, because she is the 'last root' in the Oedipus family, will be 'cut down in turn by the long, bloody knife swung by the gods of death.' Through reading the Chorus, we realize that it is a foreshadow of Antigone's death, her being the 'last root' of the family, being 'cut down in turn' by the 'long, bloody knife.' The Chorus tells the reader of Antigone's family and the many sorrows that occured in the 'house of Oedipus,' and how this race can 'find no release,' where sorrow keeps 'piling on the sorrows of the dead' and ultimately Antigone too will be cut down.
One of the things that stuck out most to me most from the lecture was Creon’s line where he says, “And is Thebes about to tell me how to rule? […] Am I to rule this land for others or for myself? […] The city is the king’s-that’s the law!” (Sophocles, p.97, ln.821) While at first Creon’s exclamation must seem ridiculous to a modern audience, it reflects the inherent disdain for monarchies and oligarchies an ancient Athenian audience would have had. The character model that Sophocles gives to Creon can be viewed in a historical context; where it becomes clear that it is not merely stereotyped archetype – but rather, a recurring theme among governments who rule without the consensus of the people.
The first thing that came to mind after looking at Creon’s speech was the Legalist philosophy which dominated the Qin dynasty of China in the third century BC. The Legalists believed in the absolute power of the state, and that the purpose of the people was to serve the ruler. Li Si was one of the chief Legalist proponents, and in a letter to the Second Emperor, Qin Ershi, preserved in Sima Qian’s Shiji, or Records of the Grand Historian, he says, “If [the Son of Heaven] cannot [...] exploit the empire for his own gratification, but merely makes it his duty to weary his body and strain his spirit in order to serve the hundred clans, then he is a lackey of the black-headed people (commoners), not the caretaker of the empire. How could such a man be called honored?” (Shiji, Biography of Li Si) Clearly, Sophocles uses Creon as a tool to criticize the Theban Monarchy.
I am responding to 3 lines that jumped out to me in Antigone. The lines are 706-709 These lines are said when Creon is telling his son, Haemon about Antigone’s fate for her defiance against the state: “Son, you;ve heard the final verdict on your bride? Are you coming now, raving against your father? Or do you love me, no matter what I do?
I thought this passage was interesting because throughout the play, Creon is explaining to everybody that everything must be done for the greatness of the state. However, he contradicts that argument in these lines. He is asking his son to put aside all of his beliefs and do something solely for the love of his father. Typically Creon’s actions and words say to put the country or state above family. This is where Antigone has defied him. However, in these lines, Creon tells his son to put family above all else. Creon could be doing this for two reasons: Either he has realized that family is more important than anything else or the more likely situation, he is manipulating his son to be on his side by appealing to his son’s love.
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